Kimi Raikkonen, Sebastian Vettel, Ferrari, Albert Park, 2015

Raikkonen & Vettel say Ferrari could have taken third

2015 Australian Grand Prix

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Kimi Raikkonen, Sebastian Vettel, Ferrari, Albert Park, 2015Both Ferrari drivers believe they could have beaten Felipe Massa to third place in qualifying for the Australian Grand Prix.

Kimi Raikkonen and Sebastian Vettel both qualified within a tenth of a second of the Williams driver and believe their was more time in the car.

“On my quick lap, I lost around three tenths at turn three and then I made a couple of mistakes in the next two corners,” said Raikkonen.

“We knew we couldn’t fight the Mercedes, at least not in today’s qualifying, but third place on the grid was possible.”

Vettel said it was “a shame that third place escaped us, as that would have made us the first team behind Mercedes”.

“We lost third place because my first run wasn’t quick enough. I’m not very pleased with myself, because there was still some performance to be found, which would have meant I’d have qualified one place higher.

“In terms of strategy, maybe we could have done something different, but basically the result is down to me.”

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Keith Collantine
Lifelong motor sport fan Keith set up RaceFans in 2005 - when it was originally called F1 Fanatic. Having previously worked as a motoring...

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90 comments on “Raikkonen & Vettel say Ferrari could have taken third”

  1. Ferrari will be 3rd and 4th tomorrow

    1. Will they? The Williams’ long runs tended to look even better than Ferrari’s, and Felipe’s not a bad starter. Vettel might end up stuck behind him. Also, we don’t know if Ferrari have effectively fixed their fuel consumption problems that often made them lack punch come Sunday.

      1. I don’t think vettel will be stuck behind Massa.
        Last season was a different story. He wasn’t motivated about it at all. This is a new chapter and I already see how excited he is to be in the front once again. And for the long runs, kimi did fantastic job during final testing.

        1. I really don’t like all this “unmotivated” talk. If you’re in a job that earns you 8 figures per year and is physically and mentally so demanding that you have to practice and train as a fulltime job … there is simply no room to not be motivated when you’re actually sitting behind the steering wheel.
          I hear that very often whenever another drop in performance by Räikkönen needs explaining, but that’s mostly because his fans don’t want to hear that he might not be as good a driver as they think he is, and that his limited abilities mean that he is very susceptible to little changes.

  2. I think so too, but had Bottas had a proper lap he could’ve done so too. Will be a good fight tomorrow between the two (four).

    1. Ferrari believe they could have been 3rd. Williams know they are 3rd.

  3. Come on guys, get that tomorrow. Some positive vibes from Ferrari after quite sometime.

    1. Yes no doubt, and there’s still a lot of performance to come out of that car in 2015. It’s a shame though that considering how much more sensible this car is, the team still believes the 2015 design was tainted by poor technical choices.

      1. @peartree I would agree with Arrivabene. The Mercs and Ferrari should be fighting a battle of their own as a engine manufacturers with their own chassis. Instead Ferrari are fighting with the works team.

        2015 is an improvement but Mercs are still far away. Maybe Ferrari target a lot more than the odd podiums.

        1. @evered7 It’s clear that most teams are late with their 2015 aero package, only 2 teams introduced the shortest nose possible, RBR has even admitted that the rear of their car was made to work with the new nose they haven’t successfully crash test. In F1 time compounds, dominance grows year after year but I think this year that Mercs rivals are actually going to end up closer to Merc than last year. This can only happen when Ferrari and RBR bring the new aero package and Ferrari ditches the conservative PU they brought to Melbourne and Renault starts reaping the rewards of their restructure, all in all for all 3 Merc opposers 2015 is a testing season.

  4. Ferrarin improved a lot. As for Raikkonen 2015 starts the same way 2014 ended. Beaten by his team mate. #overrated

    1. Wait and Watch, He’s better preserving tyres and maintaining Race Pace – So I doubt we should bash him up so early in the season (Infact 1st Race – No way)

      1. Yes, don’t forget he won the race two years ago.

      2. Like the time in India Raikkonen lost the entire race because he couldn’t make his tyres last another two laps? Or the time in Germany he threw his race strategy away because he refused to stay out (and stop hitting people)?

        1. Keep trying.

    2. Yeah, a qualification specialist like Vettel being 3 hundredths of a second faster is clearly an embarrassment for Raikkonen. /s

      1. vettel aborted the last lap, im sure he would have been quicker. ferrari could have been .7 or so behind mercedes, and ahead of williams, but a few errors, waiting for coming races.

      2. I am simply pointing out a fact @patrickl. Kimi hasn’t consistently beaten a team mate in a long time. He is probably the second worst WC since 1997 (worst is Button who won his WC on sheer luck). I am willing to bet the house he finishes behind Vettel this year.

        1. @pmccarthy_is_a_legend

          the second worst WC since 1997

          Not bad considering only six drivers have won the championship from 1998 onwards..

          1. haha, I would have to go back to 1980 to find a worse one. @wsrgo

        2. @pmccarthy_is_a_legend

          He is probably the second worst WC since 1997

          I think he’s more like the champion who spent the (2nd?) highest percentage of his prime under MSC’s shadow since 1997.

        3. What are you talking about? The only reason Kimi is not a 3-time world champion is him being unlucky and the ybreliability of the 2003 and 2005 McLaren cars. Kimi is up there with Vettel, Alonso and Hamilton IMO.

          1. Unreliability*

        4. @pmccarthy_is_a_legend
          I think I like you. A lot.

        5. I keep hearing this “sheer luck” about Button’s WDC. How is his WDC any different from anyone else who’s had a dominant car? It’s not, people like you just keep repeating what they hear.

          Oh, it’s because they found a “loophole” in the regulations… Well, that’s how F1 works! Every team is always looking for that interpretation of the rules that will work to their advantage, and if they find it it’s not because they were “lucky”

          1. For sure there are other WDC’s who had a dominant car. What makes Button stand out is that his WDC was truly a one hit wonder. He has not been close neither before or after.

            Hamilton had a dominant car in 2014. But he also had to beat a competitive teammate to be WDC. And he has a WDC from 2008 to prove that he is not a one hit wonder.

          2. Well, there is the fact that after a very dominant streak by Button, he started qualifying abysmally, very often outside the top 10. His lead was saved by two circumstances: 5 different drivers won races and more or less clashed with each other, so no one was able to capitalise on Button’s absence from the lead.
            The other reason Button was “just lucky” is the fact that his team mate Barricchello was unilaterally plagued by unreliability and errors by the team, costing him about as many points as he would’ve needed to to get Button into trouble, including some instances where these problems meant he dropped back behind Buttons, who had been very far behind him, and thus could make more points than he would have.

            2009 is the only instance of a championship I remember where I feel that the champion really wasn’t a worthy champion.

      3. This.

        Kimi’s average starting position where he won his races from is 4,1 (Alonso’s 3, Vettel’s 1,3!!!! The latter never even won a race from lower than 3th). He was never so great on Saturdays. Maybe the one from 2003 and his 3 poles from 2006 are an exception…

    3. Why do people underestimate Vettel so much? He won 4 WDC in a row, for crying out loud! And this is a 35 year old Kimi, not the one from his McLaren days. A .03 second gap is quite trivial.

      1. I don’t, Vettel is excellent. Kimi is pretty rubbish. There, it seems we are in agreement, pretty much, @praxis

        1. @pmccarthy_is_a_legend You should probably stay with Moto GP and forget F1.

        2. I already responded to your other comment about Kimi and I will again.

          Pretty rubish? He came 2nd in the WDC in 2003 in his 3rd season in Formula One with a car that had unreliability issues. I really don’t think that’s pretty rubish.

          1. One thing I forgot to say is that he lost the championship to Michael Schumacher by only 2 points in 2003.

          2. Peppermint-Lemon (@)
            14th March 2015, 16:54

            The Ferrari in 2003 was not a good car, it was Schumacher skill that dragged WDC out of it. Kimi should’ve nailed it that year on car pace.

          3. @peppermint-lemon

            The Ferrari in 2003 was not a good car, it was Schumacher skill that dragged WDC out of it. Kimi should’ve nailed it that year on car pace.

            IMO Williams should have nailed it, but Montoya and Ralf screwed up. The Ferrari F2003 overheated its tyres in comparison to the other frontrunners, while Mclaren used their 2002 car, the MP4-17, as their 2003 car failed its crash test and never raced.

    4. Ferrari intra team battle? My money is on Seb.

    5. Couldn’t agree with you more! Kimi is overrated, for sure.

    6. @pmccarthy_is_a_legend
      In 2003, Kimi challenged for the WDC until the final race of the season with a car that was, in my eyes, 3rd best on the grid.

      @peppermint-lemon and @david-a
      Williams had the best car in 2003, closely followed by Ferrari, and then McLaren. Kimi was the best driver of 2003, closely followed by Schumacher, and then Montoya.

      In 2004 the MP4/18 was a dog of a car for much of the year, yet he had many spectacular performances in it. Including his win in Belgium, as well as some brilliant drives in Silverstone and Brazil

      In 2005, he absolutely demolished Montoya on raw pace and only reliability prevented him from winning the title that year. He also had many brilliant comeback drives, such as from 17th to 1st (Suzuka), 13th to 2nd (France), and 12th to 3rd (Silverstone), in an era where overtaking was much more difficult than it is today.

      In Bahrain 2006, he went from 22nd to 3rd. Then he took 3 pole positions (Germany, Hungary, Monza) with an inferior car to Ferrari and Renault.

      In 2007, he beat Alonso and Hamilton to the WDC with a roughly equal car despite having more reliability problems. His drive at Fuji (22nd to 3rd in monsoon conditions) was stuff of legends.

      Only someone who began watching F1 in 2008 would claim that Raikkonen is only “average”.

      1. Exactly!
        Just leave him alone, he knows what he’s doing.

        Time will tell, I believe Vettel will be destroyed by the end of the year. Vettel is overrated and I’ve been waiting for this year where he’ll pair up with another champion and great driver on the other side of his garage. Kimi has still got it. Let’s see. 27 yr Vs 35 yr { Vet is desperate and trying hard, Kimi – the iceman as always is calm & cool }
        Sorry Mr. Vettel, enjoy your … battle of friends err… team-mates err…rivals :D

        1. And also sorry Vet fans, I’ve watched all his seasons, he’s an average driver (who’s been lucky to over-achieve to his talent) (even HUL or GRO or BOT is better if you give them RBRs what he had). I’ll definitely appreciate for his occasional genuine performance. But, overall I’ll only agree he’s reasonably one of the top talents only if he beats RAI, ALO or HAM as team-mate. Now is your chance, prove it! :P
          PS: I didn’t mention RIC as he has already destroyed him.

          1. @functor

            I’ve watched all his seasons, he’s an average driver

            No you haven’t, and no he isn’t.

        2. Exactly!
          Just leave him alone, he knows what he’s doing.

          Pot meeting kettle?

          I don’t know who has made the most ridiculous comments, the one bashing Kimi or you bashing Vettel.

          But what I know is that none of you know much about F1

    7. Kimi has always been a better racer than qualifier. Look at how many races he’s won from the 3rd or 4th row compared to Vettel.

      1. Appels and Oranges.

        Vettel has never had a car that was capable of outdragging others in a straight line.
        And seeing as going around the outside of someone recquires Mercedes 2015 levels of pace advantage he (and Webber) always struggled once behind other, slower cars.

        Raikkonen did have cars with great straight line speed. But moreover, before Vettel joined, cars didn’t really overtake on track now did they. It was just a case of taking in more fuel to start the race with, following slower cars until they pitted, increase the pace in free air and come out ahead after the pitstop. I really doubt Vettel would have not been able to do that.

  5. They seemed Quite Confident. Good to hear positive feedback rather than lousy comments from past couple of years. They are back in Hunt and probably will be there (I Wish) whenever Merc Falters Somewhere. 2 Wins – will not be easy and may be we should wait by Malaysia to get clear picture of line-up

  6. The fight with Williams is going to be extremely close and will be one of the most interesting things this year. Ricciardo, who did find a very good lap for a car só problematic, will be a round too and may be stronger than both at race pace. Lets see.

  7. The drivers should have done better, but Ferrari did mess up Vettel’ strategy. Who does the last run on used tyres?
    And they shouldn’t have used softs in Q1 at all. The second run on softs in Q2 was unnecessary too. Ferrari was too overcautious. Vettel looked like the fastest driver of Williams&Ferrari in Q1 and Q2. What a shame.

  8. Loving this pair.

    1. Absolutely! I got really bummed up last year when RBR didn’t get Raikkonen to pair Vettel because they seem such an obviously strong pairing, but but having it in a Ferrari is even better. Can’t wait to see these guys race.

  9. Damn car is clearly strong, ALO tut tut tut…

  10. HamiltonNumber1
    14th March 2015, 11:41

    So they both did not get the most out the car? Well atleast they have something in common from last year as they did alot of that. I do hope they win races though aslong as Ham wins the WC. Think it will be nice to eventually have Vet in red with Ric and Alo fighting the Mercs think we will have to wait awhile though. I would love a season where 2 cars and both drivers fight for the WC. Would be cool seeing Ferrari and Merc go at it. Ham vs Vet(kings of F1 since 07). Just hope Alo gets a deserved WC his talent is not 2 WC im sorry.

  11. I said it last year.based on the deficit these two drivers had last year with respect of their team mates (Alonso and ricciardo). These two drivers would be evenly matched this season. The sad part is that if Alonso or ricciardo were driving one of the ferraris’ they would have been at least .500-.700 faster than both of these drivers. The funny thing is that not matter how good this Ferrari car is compare to last year’s, they still qualified in the same place Alonso used to put his car in almost every qualifying in the last 4-5 seasons.

    1. Totally irrelevant. The following point has been made already but here it is again: What’s the point of having a fast driver if he can’t help develop the car. Ferrari have been nowhere for 5 years and now Fernando’s gone, they seem to be going in the right direction.

      Schumacher has never been the fastest or the most impressive driver, but 15 years ago, he was the missing link that was needed to make the dream team Brawn-Byrne-Schumacher work. I think that Vettel is the missing link that Ferrari needs to create a new dream team: Arrivabene-Allison-Vettel.

      For the first time in years, I’m a Ferrari fan. Can’t we just all agree it is funnier for the fans to see two happy drivers than two drivers complaining all the time about the car being …

      1. I don’t think Vettel actually contributed anything to the car yet. Even if he has, it might only come over the course of the season.
        What I see though is that the car is neutral or suited to both drivers compared to how it was earlier. I don’t know about Massa’s style but definitely Kimi didn’t like it.
        I see no reason as to why Alonso wouldn’t tell the team the deficits in the car. It is not helping him nor the team and I find that theory absurd.

        Anyway, Alonso’s gone and it is of no use to talk about what he might have, now. Hope he manages to achieve that elusive 3rd. I will cheer for him if it happens, even though I am a Ferrari fan.

        1. +100000000

      2. “Schumacher has never been the fastest or the most impressive driver”…stay away from drugs mate…;)

        1. I was born the year Schumacher won his first world title, so maybe I’m just too young to have seen Schumacher at his best: his run at Mercedes wasn’t exactly impressive.

          1. Yes, you are too young to remember, but you can look at stats, no?

          2. @lari Stats aren’t the whole story. If you would look only at stats, Schumacher would be the best driver in F1 ever but some people here are defending Senna pretty hard you know. Senna, who was beaten by his team mate in 1989, is considered the best driver of all time by many. Quite bizarre.

            Also, why isn’t Hulkenberg a multiple world champion by now? He seems a beast when you see his stats in the lower categories.

          3. Yes, you are definitely too young…don’t forget that Schumacher in his spell in Mercedes was 41 to 43 yo, way past his prime, fighting with guys half his age and yet he manage to tale a pole in Monaco. I suggest you to see on YouTube his ’96 win in Barcelona, you’ll understand immediately why he’s among the best drivers there’s ever been, if not the best of them all…

          4. Impressive stuff.

            Sad thing is, that race would probably be red flagged nowadays with the rubbish wet tires we have.

      3. Yeaah right, the only change at Ferrari has been Vet replacing Alo, that’s proof +.

    2. Nonsense. Ricciardo was 0.1s on average faster than Vettel in quali, so how did you came up with at least 0.7s?

    3. It doesn’t work like that though, does it? Neither Kimi or Vettel were suited to their cars last season. In 1990, Prost scored more than double the points than Mansell, who didn’t like the car. You can’t base a driver’s performance on one year.

      1. @james Correct. And what @paeschli above stated is also spot on. What I noted from the comments of Seb and Kimi today was that, despite a good result, the blame for being only 4th and 5th should be placed on them, not the team. Perhaps the reason that a driver change was made was less because of development skills and more because of exchanging a driver with a historic destructive team record (McLaren, Renault, Ferrari) with one who is a well know team builder? The spitefulness of some commenters is disturbing.

    4. The sad part is that if Alonso or ricciardo were driving one of the ferraris’ they would have been at least .500-.700 faster than both of these drivers.

      I like when people make claims like this without anything to back this up. The casrs are totally different and perhaps Ricciardo and Alonso wouldn’t have been comfortable with them

    5. The sad part is that if Alonso or ricciardo were driving one of the ferraris’ they would have been at least .500-.700 faster than both of these drivers.

      The sad part is that you actually believe that nonsense!

  12. Good to hear that Ferrari has more potential than just this.

    Going to be an epic battle for 3th to 6th.

  13. Given that Williams and Ferrari have started the year on equal (one lap) pace, it should be interesting to see which team can develop the quickest, and also which driver paring can pull in the biggest sum of points over the season. Whatever the outcome, I very much like the new Ferrari as a team, feels like there is a lot less tention, and more time for fun.

  14. As a long time Ferrari fan, I have to say I’m feeling some cautious positivity after this session. Looks like they’re at least starting the season somewhere near the podium, let’s see where they can go from here. It’s also very refreshing to hear the phrase ‘disappointed’ when qualifying 4th and 5th.

    1. @npf1 It is, but I hope ‘underqualifying’ is not something they have inherited from the Alonso days…

  15. Ferrari has proven that they are going in the right direction, they can’t think about World Championships now, but the future is certainly bright for them in a few years.

    Also, McHonda is performing terribly.

    And I believe the Mercedes-Hamilton deal should be completed soon enough, either Mercedes or Hamilton wants to look for a new partner.

    So am I the only one who sees Fernando back at Ferrari when Kimi retires?

    1. I think Alonso will just give up and go off to the Mans..

    2. I very much doubt that they’d take him back. They didn’t much like him while he was there and they parted with mutual dislike on both sides. Plus, he’s nearly as old as Kimi. When Kiimi retires they’ll hire some young gun to take his place.

      1. @rm: What about Hülkenberg? If Kimi retires for good in two years, “Hulk” could finally have a seat in a top team he’s been waiting for.

    3. If Hamilton signs for Mercedes then I see Ferrari perhaps looking at Bottas for 2017. Finn for Finn.

      Bottas seemed a shoe-in for Mercedes but at the moment I don’t see either Hamilton or Rosberg leaving or getting the boot. Perhaps if there’s anymore bad behaviour from Rosberg (like at Spa), they might think about a change, but it’s unlikely.

  16. @paeschli
    The biggest differentiator these two seasons has been the PU. Ferrari got it wrong totally. That in no part can be attributed to the driver.

    Vettel joined in 2009 with the RB team. He won the 2nd and 3rd races of the year, fyi. RB had a good car already but were trumped by the DD of Brawn. It is attributed to the genius of Newey not anything else.

    Ferrari would have sacked Alonso if they knew he was a dead end. I am sure they are intelligent enough to access the driver than arm chair critics like us.

    1. He won the 2nd and 3rd races of the year

      Button won F1’s most recent race in which the winner got <10 points.

    2. @davidnotcoulthard Thanks for correcting it. It was Button who won the race. But RB did get their first win at the Chinese GP which was the third race of the season.

    3. Ferrari would have sacked Alonso if they knew he was a dead end.

      By all accounts they pushed him out the door. You could call that “sacked” if you wanted to.

      RB had a good car already but were trumped by the DD of Brawn. It is attributed to the genius of Newey not anything else.

      So the Brawn was the better car at the time, as you admit, and STILL Vettel’s win is to be attributed to “the genius of Newey”!

      1. @rm they still believe that nonsense. And if RIC fails to win this year in a Newey Car, it’s Renault’s fault because RIC is the best, and VET the oh so average driver as they they say he is only won in Newey Designed Cars.

      2. I was replying to a post which has now been deleted. I can’t bother explaining it to you. The RB car was fast in 2009 but Brawn was class of the field. It was not all down to Vettel’s brilliance in 2009.

        I am not against Vettel but trying to address a point that the OP made regarding RBR in 2009.

  17. First off, it looks like Ferrari has improved against the Red Bull and Williams but….have they?
    In the last couple of years, Alonso frequently qualified in 5th place over the years but when the actual race took place he had trouble holding it unless those ahead had troubles. Not to take credit away from his incredible performances race after race.
    Tomorrow will tell the tale but I expect Williams to finish ahead of red and possibly Dan R.
    It’s interesting how Kimi and Seb are both claiming they screwed up. Kimi won’t have the excuses he used last year as the car is now to his liking. It won’t be long before he realizes Ferrari favor Vettel and he is the number 2 driver.

    1. Check FP2 analysis article in this site. You will get the answer. Williams might finish ahead or they might not. But no way RB is getting ahead of these two teams unless there is a problem.

      Also if you put together Kimi’s best sector times, he is actually only a second behind Hamilton’s time. Faster than what Vettel managed over the qualifying session.

  18. It’s going to be a rough battle with Williams and Ferrari tomorrow, that’s for sure. Mercedes seem to be unbeatable, but if Massa would get a dream start, that would add some extra spice into race. I’m still delighted to see that Ferrari has actually improved during the winter.

  19. Everybody could be 3rd but no one gives credit to the guy who actually is 3rd.
    Massa outperformed both and his teammate too and is going to be a challenge for the last step on the podium, albeit i somehow believe Rosberg isn’t going to see the checkered flag today.

  20. What’s with all the Seb vs Kimi, who is overrated, who is underrated?

    I think both of them are good drivers and really good friends on and off track.

    And for those who are saying RIC is one of the very best driver, yes. He will win title, 1 or 2, but he is not as highly rated as it is.

  21. Did you guys see Vettel’s life vest in that picture?? Perfect for Monaco if you get in the harbor.

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